http://www.lopoline.com/catalog/item/67 ... 615783.htm


Seems pretty cool, but yet I can get the finished product for $25 more ...

http://www.lopoline.com/catalog/item/36 ... 319480.htm







On a similar note, is it even worth it for me to try to build my own cab. Looking into materials and such, I really wouldn't be saving a ton of money, and there is also that pesky time element. But, I kind of want a thinner cab as opposed to the 27" deep lopo design.

Any suggestions on a thinner, openback 2x10 cab design I should look into?

I could almost base it off of the HRD combo cab I snagged from tor, I wish I could modify it but glued and nailed wood has a tendency to like to stay that way.

Mainly, the bulk of what you would be saving would be the shipping cost, between flatpack'd and finished, which should be a substantial cost break, i'd think.

From scratch, speaker cabs are a little moar tricky than things like head cabs for DIY-friendliness. Certain types of fuckups can get you lousy sounding or buzzy shitcabs.

As for dimensions, it is generally best to stick to some known quantities. If you like the sound of the HRD cab, you could copy it. I would be more wary of just lopping off a couple/few inches of depth from the lopo dimensions though. You can get yourself all kinds of badsounding cabs by altering stuff without either knowing some shit about speaker cabinets maths, or having sometyhing to copy that you know sounds good.

Lastly, what don't you like aboot the HRDcab? Or is it just that it has a big ole hole in the top where the map used to be?

Also: out of curiosity, what are the dimensions of the HRD?

I'm not sure, but I can measure it up tonight.

EDIT: I DO know it is less than half the depth of my Avatar 1x12, which is probably about 27" deep.

And I really do not dislike the HRD cab, which is why I considered doing a non-combo clone. The issues really come in with the hole in the top (it is kinda ugo) and the back panel which is no longer permanently affixed, yet houses the speaker input jack. I could of course remove the back panel, but then I have to remount the input jack and such.

REALLY what I wish I could do, and you might be able to help me here, is turn the HRD combo cab and the Vox LNT into a combo, alas the whole for the HRD amp is much much wider than the LNT. If I could lop the top off, replace it with a new plank with a hole cut to match the LNT, make some sort of mounting bracket for the LNT then I could have a convertible combo/head setup. Alas, I am not entirely sure that has been done, or with good results. I would be worried about a lot of vibration causing noise/damage by the amp not being solidly connected to the cab.

My main concerns, beside the vibration, is modifying the cab itself.

I would suspect that the HRD would be made of particle board, no?

Even if plywood, no, i would not expect it to come apart well enough to allow such modificationz. In theory, it could maybe have its top sawed off and a new top simply affixed, but i would not expect that to be pretty necessarily, and that type of construction might be expected to give worry later, as it would probably wind up being less solid in build than the original cab. It would also most likely be a huge pain in the jimmy, to get the top sawed off cleanly enough and removed from the baffle it is most likely glued to. Undoing only one set glued edge is easier than five, but like, still: not easy.

As for making the Vox into some sort of HRcab combo, i probably wouldn't do that myself, because IMO, EL84s rattle themselves to shit quickly enough when not mounted to speakers. BUT. for you maybe the combo convenience would outweigh the EL84 death toll.

I am not super familiar with the size and mounting points of the Vox either, so i couldn't say how best that might be tackled. I am reasonably sure it would be doable though. Just, a bit fiddly. [It would however, most likely involve the removal/ditching of the shiny metal top bit, to use its mounting screw holes to affix the chassis to ye olde combo cab, in a more standard-ish combomap type manner.]

Pretty much what I expected, so yeah nix that idea.

So i will probably just make a copy of the HRD cab, but make it a bit more of a solid 2x10 cab.

Now I know I SHOULD be fancy and do proper joints and such, but I have heard/seen some cabs built with ghetto-joints that reportedly turned out well. I figure I could assemble a wooden box easily enough, but question is should I bother going to my carpenter friend to have fancy joints cut out or should I just go the simple route.


I, of course, am leaning to the ghetto side.

Ghettojoints for headcabs are a-ok.

Ghettojoints for speakercabs, notsomuch.

I would say: have yer carpenterfriend do nice joints. In this case, "nice" could still be glued dado or whatever. Which is all you are getting from the lopoline anyhoo. But it is important in the avoidance of buzzes, that you have solid tight construction in place.

Now, it might even be simpler for you carpenterfriend to do boxjoints or dovetails if that is what they are used to or whatever. Like, i am not really set up to do good dado cuts, so i just rock boxjoints and floating baffles in my own ghettocabs. The box/dovetails are prettier and way stronger than you really need though, especially prettier if you are going to tolex the thing.

Mainly though, you don't want to just be trying to glue up edge to edge straight up with no other supporting structure. It will not be stable for vibrating via the speakers and bouncing around in and out of gigs and whatnot. It will be more likely to start buzzing badly, or indeed to just come apart at the seams over time.

I am sure he could cut dado if not dovetail joints.

He builds furniture as a hobby, and has a ridiculous shop setup in his garage. He is rather handy from what I can tell. All I would need is the joint cuts, then I can glue and nail and such easily enough.

Time to start measuring up and looking into wood. I see a lot companies using the 13-ply 3/4" birch, but should I maybe look into pine? I can get plenty of it around here for cheap, though I have no idea what 13-ply birch is running.

Wood, you can maybe go a little ghetto on. It will also depend on what your friend wants to work with.

Basically, the best choice for speaker cabs is going to be baltic/marine grade birch plywood in 3/4" or 18mm. The upside is that there are no knotholes or voids in the inside layers of the plys. The downside, is that it is harder to source, and fairly costly(last i chzeched, aboot $90 for a 4x8 sheet?).

Oh also, while the basic box is generally 3/4" or 18mm, the speaker baffle and back can be either 1/2" or 3/4", depending on what size the cab is, and whether or not you want the baffles to move much. For instance, a 4x12 will often use a 3/4 front baffle, though sometimes a 1/2" back one. A 1x12 cab will often use a 1/2" front and back baffle. Some open back fender combos even use a 1/4" thickness for the back panels(like the Hotrods actually, IIRC).

Anyhow, regarding voidless/voided plywoods, you can go void-y birch or pine and hope for the best though; the cost is enough less, and it will still probably yield a nicer cabinet than particleboard or MDF.

Pine might be fine for a small 2x10. The old fender combos used pine ply or solid pine back in the days. It is a different sound than a birch cab though. Much softer, looser low end, and with less definition. The softer wood of a pine cab moves around more than birch would, it absorbs certain frequencies that birch would reflect more of, and is more prone to being affected by resonances from the speakers.

Worst case scenario, this can yield a muddy undefined cabinet with attenuated bass projection that actually physically bounces around on the floor. That is a lot less likely with a low powered amp though. It will more likely seem bassy and resonant without much definition to the low end compared to birch. But in an open back cab, it can be nice, and can also tame a little high end in really bright amps. In general, a pine cab will maybe feel quieter than a birch one, as more sound pressure goes to moving the wood (versus being projected out of the cabinet) than is generally the case with a birch cab.

Birch is physically harder, sturdier, and heavier, and it is sonically tighter, louder, and brighter, with better low end projection. It is less prone to resonating at odd frequencies than pine. It is moar expensive also.

I think they used to be worth it while they were cheaper... My 2x12 is a lopo and it does it job pretty well (not a kit though):nods:

BTW: aren't "holy grail" old school (70's) Marshall Cab pine?

As far as i am aware they are birch.

The main differences i am aware of with the normal(meaning like anything but the cheapo all particleboard MG ones) Marshalls, is that the back panels used to be birch, but later switched to particle board.

The rest of the cab is and was birch though, i believe. Old Fenders definitely used pine, both solid wood, and pine ply, in different eras.

I measured and wrote down all the dimensions of the HRD, but forgot to bring the piece of paper to Dunkin Donuts (no internet at the new apartment yet) ...

But, I do remember it is only 9.5" deep, and about 23" wide, and IIRC 19" tall. So, a pretty thin box in general. Also it does have the 1/4 back panel, but I haven't checked out the front panel yet. But, from what I can tell, it really will not be too pricey to put together, especially since it is so thin. I think I will go with birch, though honestly from what I have read pine may be better for the super bright LNT.

Now I just need to like, plan this out or something.

I also need to figure out what I want it to look like, to match this ugly bastid:

They're birch. Birch back up 'til I wanna say '73 or so. That is really the only difference save for the speakers and jacks/wiring. They're not the burliest cabs on the planet (I think the Mills cabs take that. That is overbuilt kit!) But they do sound nice. My co-guitarist's 1982 (model number, not year; late '70s) seems to be identical to a 1960, with the particle board back- replaced- shitty handles, etc. Looks awesomely destroyed and sounds great.

Now, if you can get your hands on a Marshall Mode Four cab, those are essentially Marshall's take on a Recto cab. Dodgy amp, manly cab to go with it. And a ply back, too.

Much Fender stuff is pine. I wouldn't be surprised if the Super I use occasionally is pine; I never checked. My Vox looks like birch.

The Marshall thing I always used to correct people on on HCAF; there's so much inaccurate information floating around about them, which is hilarious in a way because they're ubiquitous rockhardware that largely hasn't changed since the Pleistocene save for speaker choices and the switching jacks.

So yeah it turns out all those years of smoking weed didn't completely destroy my memory, the HRD cab dimensions are 9.5" deep, 23" wide and 18" tall. It is a fairly light weight little box too, which I can dig. I am not looking for a perfect cab, as I am running a $200 amp through it, and I like the size of the HRD so I think I might clone it.

Next question, how open should my open back be?

I might just be an ass, but I was thinking of, due to space constraints in a tiny apartment and the narrow design of the LNT, making this cab a vertical cab, which would impose certain issues to the cloning-the-HRD design.

While the dimensions could stay the same, the baffle would have to be angled differently. This would leave me with two options, angling the entire baffle or a half-slanted baffle ala your standard 4x12.




That is actually the side of a vertical 2x12 cabinet.


Now, I am talking about not building a box. Instead this would have partially angled sides and such, which would require a bit more work, but not anything incredibly drastic as far as I can tell.

Or, is this going to be a bit more complex than I am thinking?



Edit: Or, could I just not slant the baffle at all and just build a vertical box. Lots of places sell vertical cabs that are not slanted, but I really don't know what they do with the baffle.

Interesting. Those dimensions are actually pretty close to the 1x12 i built. I guess the two speakers are pretty close to each other? Or are they mounted on an angle, with one high and one low?

As for openback openbackness, i have built cabs with 1/3(my 2x12) open and 1/2(my 1x12) open, and both functioned well. What i usually do is make a full back for the cab, only split it into two or three panels, and have it so i can run it closed if i want, or remove a panel if i want it open.

I would probably just leave as much open as the HRD has open. Maybe also with the back of the chassis that used to be in there, just to be replaced with a piece of wood.

The speakers are placed one high one low in there to keep them at a distance, which is what I planned on doing.

It is about 1/3 open back right now, and I was thinking of doing a 1/2 open back with another 1/2 back panel so I could convert it to closed back if I wanted, similar to the Avatar/Lopoline convertible cab designs. Seems like an easy and logical thing to do.

Yo, there is a bit more to making a slant cab than it might seem. There are certain ways around some of the fiddly bits(like not having the baffle have a compound angle, but rather have it as a single slanted baffle) but even then it can be a little tricky how they fit together.

As simpler solution would definitely be to build a straight cab. That is what i have built, and i have often taken advantage of the fact that they can either be used vertically or horizontally.

The baffle would just be straight, like a 1960B or something. The baffle can be flat or slightly leaned back like this if you want the speakers to aim slightly upward:



Personally, i would probably be inclined to just mount the baffle flat, like an Emperor 2x12 or 4x12. I am not generally a fan of fiddly angles in things.

In that case, I am just going to build an HRD-clone cab with a straight baffle so I can flip it about however I please. I really don't need the angled baffle anyways, as I sit about 1' away from the amp when I play (small space)


Plus the simplicity of it all just makes sense for the trying to do it quick and cheap.

You you really want is an open back diagonal 2x12 ala Marshall 1966